PHX/PIT Welcome to Rapeville

[Scott]

so you turned kadri and okposo into skinner?

And you turned your playoff team into what again?

hahaha, nicely done..

[anton]

so you turned kadri and okposo into skinner?

And you turned your playoff team into what again?

my playoff team? i inherited a team that finished in the middle of the pack.

i turned it into a core of young players

kopitar
oshie
okposo
kadri
kassian
adam
morin
gorges
shattenkirk
ellis
rundblad
despres

+ 3 top 10 picks this year

[Robin Hood]

so you turned kadri and okposo into skinner?

yeah it makes no sense. but keep in mind that since i acquired kane, i have acquired spezza and hejduk and roloson for chump change. that's 12.5m in cap i have added that will help me a lot in the playoffs. this trade lets me keep them all.

[Robin Hood]

btw in terms of this trade guys just keep this in mind. skinner is putting up ridiculous numbers at the age of 18. not only that but if you watch him play he hands the hands of a future 40 goal scorer. imo i just got him cheap. esp considering he will be 1.4m for 2 more years after this. thats pretty huge.

[Mike]

btw in terms of this trade guys just keep this in mind. skinner is putting up ridiculous numbers at the age of 18. not only that but if you watch him play he hands the hands of a future 40 goal scorer. imo i just got him cheap. esp considering he will be 1.4m for 2 more years after this. thats pretty huge.

YOU'RE SO AWESOME

[Shep]

Got him cheap?

No.

[Robin Hood]

Got him cheap?

No.

1.4 m for skinner vs 6.3 for kane next year will seem like a landslide win for me.

[Shoalzie]

Got him cheap?

No.

The team that drafted him originally got him cheap.

[MSP4LYFE]

Got him cheap?

No.

1.4 m for skinner vs 6.3 for kane next year will seem like a landslide win for me.

I see you are unfamiliar with the sophomore slump...

[Robin Hood]

Got him cheap?

No.

1.4 m for skinner vs 6.3 for kane next year will seem like a landslide win for me.

I see you are unfamiliar with the sophomore slump...

skinner will ride shotgun with staal. doubt any slump is happening.

[Nick]

There is no formula or magic ball that can forecast who get's hit with the sophomore slump and who does not. But it's a real risk with any 2nd year player, or any post-break-out season player.

[kimmer]

Got him cheap?

No.

1.4 m for skinner vs 6.3 for kane next year will seem like a landslide win for me.

I see you are unfamiliar with the sophomore slump...

Stamkos

lol jk I know he's a rare exception

[Nick]

Stamkos didn't have an explosive rookie year, same reason JT isn't slumping IMO. The Sophomore slump occurs after a good season, I believe it's because the player forgets how hard he worked in order to achieve what they did, and it takes at least half a year of hard work to get everything back in line.

The shocking guy for me who dodged the slump was Patty Kane.


But just look @ this year:

Doughty is having a rough post-awesome-year season.
Evander Kane with a "meh" rookie season is not have a slump.
MDZ who had a wild rookie season, has slumped very badly.
Myers who had a good rookie season, has slumped a little, not as good as last year.


Last year Grabo slumped hard.
Wheeler slumped last year.

[Robin Hood]

But just look @ this year:

Doughty is having a rough post-awesome-year season.
Evander Kane with a "meh" rookie season is not have a slump.
MDZ who had a wild rookie season, has slumped very badly.
Myers who had a good rookie season, has slumped a little, not as good as last year.


Last year Grabo slumped hard.
Wheeler slumped last year.

i could name a big list of players who have also gotten better in their sophomore season. skinners got unbelievable hands in tight and he has natural goal scoring ability - its a knack. you cant take that away. he wil see more and mroe ice time with staal and staal has always needed a premium winger. skinner is that guy. and any guy riding shotgun with staal has severely lesser odds of slumping. look at players who have the opportunity to play with players like staal. backstrom, kane/toews with each other, duchene, stamkos, perry etc. they only get better with time.

you will notice one big thing with sophomore slumps. a LOT of them happen with players that do not have enough support that matches their needs and/or opportunity during the season to play with such players.

[MSP4LYFE]

But just look @ this year:

Doughty is having a rough post-awesome-year season.
Evander Kane with a "meh" rookie season is not have a slump.
MDZ who had a wild rookie season, has slumped very badly.
Myers who had a good rookie season, has slumped a little, not as good as last year.


Last year Grabo slumped hard.
Wheeler slumped last year.

i could name a big list of players who have also gotten better in their sophomore season. skinners got unbelievable hands in tight and he has natural goal scoring ability - its a knack. you cant take that away. he wil see more and mroe ice time with staal and staal has always needed a premium winger. skinner is that guy. and any guy riding shotgun with staal has severely lesser odds of slumping. look at players who have the opportunity to play with players like staal. backstrom, kane/toews with each other, duchene, stamkos, perry etc. they only get better with time.

you will notice one big thing with sophomore slumps. a LOT of them happen with players that do not have enough support that matches their needs and/or opportunity during the season to play with such players.

You are completely ignoring that the Canes have other players that they can pair with Staal, and in the event of a slump, Skinner won't be paired with Staal, he may even see his pp time cut.

[Nick]

There really is no pattern to who slumps and who doesn't Shiv, tons of GREAT, AMAZING rookies (or break-out-season-players) who play with other elite players have slumped hard or even disappeared. I'm not going to get into with you, as no matter what points are brought up your always right, but saying you bought Skinner at a low/deal/cheap is incredibly wrong (this does not make it a rape or a bad trade).

[Shoalzie]

How about a guy like Matt Duchene? A guy that was a finalist for the Calder last year and has only blossomed more in his second year. He's definitely the best of the three award finalists now. Skinner is on pace to have a better rookie year than Duchene. I don't know if you can compare Duchene and Skinner yet but in another way of looking at it...would you have traded Duchene (last year) for Patrick Kane not knowing that he'd become a PPG guy? I don't think many would trade Duchene for Kane (now) knowing what we know now. It's always a risk when you trade the proven commodity for a guy you expect to develop but hasn't gotten there yet.

Teams here (over) protect their top young prospects because they don't want to be the one to trade low on a guy before you find out he's the next superstar of the league. Right now, trading Skinner is a bit of a risk because he's showing early signs of stardom but you can't judge a guy's career on 50 games. I think most of us would rather get a guy who has 5 years of proven performance over a guy that has only given you half of a season to project how they COULD perform over the long term.

[Robin Hood]

How about a guy like Matt Duchene? A guy that was a finalist for the Calder last year and has only blossomed more in his second year. He's definitely the best of the three award finalists now. Skinner is on pace to have a better rookie year than Duchene. I don't know if you can compare Duchene and Skinner yet but in another way of looking at it...would you have traded Duchene (last year) for Patrick Kane not knowing that he'd become a PPG guy? I don't think many would trade Duchene for Kane (now) knowing what we know now. It's always a risk when you trade the proven commodity for a guy you expect to develop but hasn't gotten there yet.

Teams here (over) protect their top young prospects because they don't want to be the one to trade low on a guy before you find out he's the next superstar of the league. Right now, trading Skinner is a bit of a risk because he's showing early signs of stardom but you can't judge a guy's career on 50 games. I think most of us would rather get a guy who has 5 years of proven performance over a guy that has only given you half of a season to project how they COULD perform over the long term.

lol its funny you said that. i've offered Patrick Kane + for Duchene to Billy and been rejected many times as he will tell you lol.

[Nick]

To be fair Duchene's rookie season was good but nothing unexpected, with basically identical # and 1/4 the support JT's rookie season is viewed as a disappointment; Both Duchene and JT seem to be very reasonable h2h.


For me the #'s early in the career are nice, but how they look is much more important. Hence my love of Evander Kane, scoring is only okay, but he looks fantastic. Bryan can be heard saying this to Cliff in almost every drunken hockey argument, "if the player looks good and is playing well, the numbers will come, but if the numbers are there and the play doesn't really match..."

Cliff, " I know what your saying, but you also understand from my side...blah blah blah (wasn't listening)"



Cliffy I don't mean to say your a bad judge, one of the most patient evaluators of players that I know, once u have a hate/chub on for a guy it's all but permanent.

[MSP4LYFE]

Duchene is projecting as a perennial all star with the numbers he has put up this early in his career, and unlike Kane, he has the defensive capability, and position (C) to put up strong H2H numbers. To trade that for Patrick Kane is idiotic, and I would argue that Duchene will develop into the better real life player as well.