voracek and tampa first 2015

[Bruyns]

I thought Voracek and a 1st for O'Reilly was fair too and definitely wouldn't add Jenner for him. You should shop ROR to Shiv since if he would trade Jenner and Voracek for him in a heart beat he must be very high on him since Jenner to me looks like a valuable BBKLer and Voracek and ROR are VERY similar players other than next year ROR will cost quite a bit more as Mike pointed out.

Last 3 seasons
ROR - 135gms - 92pts - 16PIMs - 328 SOG - 79 hits - 77 blocks - 1:10 SHTOI/gm
Voracek 153 gms - 107pts - 71PIMs -382SOG - 71 hits - 38 blocks - :13 SHTOI/gm

So for over 2M more you get a minute of STHOI and some extra blocks while losing some points, shots and PIMs. Don't know why someone would be called a slow horse for not wanting to give up a 20 year old putting up 3 hits a game who has the potential to put up more offence to land a player that doesn't seem like a very big upgrade.

Another example of how GMs value players differently since I would probably consider Voracek for O'Reilly straight up unless I was a team weak on PK players.

[Bruyns]

how is voracek + 1st that much different from voracek + jenner. where is this jenner value suddenly coming from.

If you believed this then you would do the deal with the 1st since it's not much different than Jenner value wise.

I think you like Jenner more than you are letting on here.

[anton]

of course i like jenner, thats why i want him in the deal. you've done well to solve that mystery. im short on roster players and would like to get 2 for o'reilly.

for a team in a different situation, i dont see a hell of a lot of difference between jenner and a mid-1st rounder.

and if jenner really holds this much value for hitting 1 category then the offers i get on frattin should really be a hell of a lot better than they are.

[kimmer]

Matt this has nothing to do with proper player valuation. Everything however, has to do with opposing GMs flexing of their muscles based on irrational pride out of their players potentials

Edit: didnt jenner come from dallas when kyle was trading away his dal 1st?? So ya..

[Chuck Norris]

how is voracek + 1st that much different from voracek + jenner. where is this jenner value suddenly coming from.

If you believed this then you would do the deal with the 1st since it's not much different than Jenner value wise.

I think you like Jenner more than you are letting on here.

Hot dog we have a wiener!

[anton]

Matt this has nothing to do with proper player valuation. Everything however, has to do with opposing GMs flexing of their muscles based on irrational pride out of their players potentials

Edit: didnt jenner come from dallas when kyle was trading away his dal 1st?? So ya..

lol yea and alex killorn and another 1st rounder. but we'll ignore that. jenner for dal 1st it was and always has been!

[Bruyns]

of course i like jenner, thats why i want him in the deal. you've done well to solve that mystery. im short on roster players and would like to get 2 for o'reilly.

for a team in a different situation, i dont see a hell of a lot of difference between jenner and a mid-1st rounder.

and if jenner really holds this much value for hitting 1 category then the offers i get on frattin should really be a hell of a lot better than they are.

Thanks, I had to break out my detective hat to solve that one. Jenner is only hitting one cat now, but I think he will PK in the future and could develop some offence. I tried getting Jenner from Pete before he traded him too, but the deal revolved around him and Brock Nelson and Pete preferred Jenner.

[anton]

I thought Voracek and a 1st for O'Reilly was fair too and definitely wouldn't add Jenner for him. You should shop ROR to Shiv since if he would trade Jenner and Voracek for him in a heart beat he must be very high on him since Jenner to me looks like a valuable BBKLer and Voracek and ROR are VERY similar players other than next year ROR will cost quite a bit more as Mike pointed out.

Last 3 seasons
ROR - 135gms - 92pts - 16PIMs - 328 SOG - 79 hits - 77 blocks - 1:10 SHTOI/gm
Voracek 153 gms - 107pts - 71PIMs -382SOG - 71 hits - 38 blocks - :13 SHTOI/gm

So for over 2M more you get a minute of STHOI and some extra blocks while losing some points, shots and PIMs. Don't know why someone would be called a slow horse for not wanting to give up a 20 year old putting up 3 hits a game who has the potential to put up more offence to land a player that doesn't seem like a very big upgrade.

Another example of how GMs value players differently since I would probably consider Voracek for O'Reilly straight up unless I was a team weak on PK players.

maybe it's just me but those numbers do nothing but show how much more valuable ROR is than voracek.

there's a 20 GP difference there. anything voracek wins (pts, sog) will be significantly closer and anything ROR leads will have even a larger gap based on even GPs. you also pass off 1 extra min of shtoi like it's nothing when it is in fact 1 extra min PER GAME. these numbers also show ROR at ages 19, 20, and 21 and voracek at 22,23, and 24.

i fail to see how these numbers weigh in Kyle's favor AT ALL. the one and only category voracek wins substantially is PIMS.

[anton]

To save you the hassle - I've run the numbers for both guys at 153 games...you know...an even comparison.

ROR 153gms - 105 pts - 18 PIMS - 371 SOG - 90 hits - 87 blocks - 1:10 SHTOI/gm
Voracek 153 gms - 107pts - 71PIMs -382SOG - 71 hits - 38 blocks - :13 SHTOI/gm

and yes, this is still ROR's 19, 20, 21 years and Voracek's 22, 23 and 24.

[Bruyns]

Thanks for the 153 game comparison above. Surprised how close they are offensively and value just depends on if you value a minute of SHTOI and extra blocks as worth 2M more per year and a 1st. The age comparison comes into play too, but they both have long careers ahead of them, but maybe ROR is better offensively in his 22,23,24 years than Voracek was.

[Robin Hood]

To save you the hassle - I've run the numbers for both guys at 153 games...you know...an even comparison.

ROR 153gms - 105 pts - 18 PIMS - 371 SOG - 90 hits - 87 blocks - 1:10 SHTOI/gm
Voracek 153 gms - 107pts - 71PIMs -382SOG - 71 hits - 38 blocks - :13 SHTOI/gm

and yes, this is still ROR's 19, 20, 21 years and Voracek's 22, 23 and 24.

Game, set, match.

And I don't even think the numbers are necessary to prove why ROR > Voracek. Voracek is not as good as people make him out to be.

[The BBKL Insider]

Voracek is a god

i once watched him light up Moncton for 13 points.

[KapG]

To save you the hassle - I've run the numbers for both guys at 153 games...you know...an even comparison.

ROR 153gms - 105 pts - 18 PIMS - 371 SOG - 90 hits - 87 blocks - 1:10 SHTOI/gm
Voracek 153 gms - 107pts - 71PIMs -382SOG - 71 hits - 38 blocks - :13 SHTOI/gm

and yes, this is still ROR's 19, 20, 21 years and Voracek's 22, 23 and 24.

Game, set, match.

And I don't even think the numbers are necessary to prove why ROR > Voracek. Voracek is not as good as people make him out to be.

You don't even know what your doing with your own team. How can anyone take you seriously?

[KapG]

I thought Voracek and a 1st for O'Reilly was fair too and definitely wouldn't add Jenner for him. You should shop ROR to Shiv since if he would trade Jenner and Voracek for him in a heart beat he must be very high on him since Jenner to me looks like a valuable BBKLer and Voracek and ROR are VERY similar players other than next year ROR will cost quite a bit more as Mike pointed out.

Last 3 seasons
ROR - 135gms - 92pts - 16PIMs - 328 SOG - 79 hits - 77 blocks - 1:10 SHTOI/gm
Voracek 153 gms - 107pts - 71PIMs -382SOG - 71 hits - 38 blocks - :13 SHTOI/gm

So for over 2M more you get a minute of STHOI and some extra blocks while losing some points, shots and PIMs. Don't know why someone would be called a slow horse for not wanting to give up a 20 year old putting up 3 hits a game who has the potential to put up more offence to land a player that doesn't seem like a very big upgrade.

Another example of how GMs value players differently since I would probably consider Voracek for O'Reilly straight up unless I was a team weak on PK players.

maybe it's just me but those numbers do nothing but show how much more valuable ROR is than voracek.

there's a 20 GP difference there. anything voracek wins (pts, sog) will be significantly closer and anything ROR leads will have even a larger gap based on even GPs. you also pass off 1 extra min of shtoi like it's nothing when it is in fact 1 extra min PER GAME. these numbers also show ROR at ages 19, 20, and 21 and voracek at 22,23, and 24.

i fail to see how these numbers weigh in Kyle's favor AT ALL. the one and only category voracek wins substantially is PIMS.

Also sog. Those stats show me its close enough that I shouldn't be adding a young waiver exemot player with high upside (for our league) over the first rounder. Especially since said player is just grtting his feet wet and is already a soljd contributor to one of the main stats I go after.


Excuse any typos please as I'm on my phone and don't wanns go through and fix them all.

[KapG]

I think the first and voracek is fair when considering the big raise for ror next season. If you don't though its cool.

[anton]

11 SOG is not even close to a substantial difference in that category - maybe 3 games.

[KapG]

Well I was looking at bryuns post. Where it says 328 vs 3whatever for voracek.

I still don't see the huge difference in value which is why I don't want to go much more than the 1st.

[Robin Hood]

To save you the hassle - I've run the numbers for both guys at 153 games...you know...an even comparison.

ROR 153gms - 105 pts - 18 PIMS - 371 SOG - 90 hits - 87 blocks - 1:10 SHTOI/gm
Voracek 153 gms - 107pts - 71PIMs -382SOG - 71 hits - 38 blocks - :13 SHTOI/gm

and yes, this is still ROR's 19, 20, 21 years and Voracek's 22, 23 and 24.

Game, set, match.

And I don't even think the numbers are necessary to prove why ROR > Voracek. Voracek is not as good as people make him out to be.

You don't even know what your doing with your own team. How can anyone take you seriously?

Oh look at that. PIT vs NYR next week. Let's see how your borderline playoff team does.

[Shep]

Probably a lot better than this borderline playoff team.

[The BBKL Insider]

To save you the hassle - I've run the numbers for both guys at 153 games...you know...an even comparison.

ROR 153gms - 105 pts - 18 PIMS - 371 SOG - 90 hits - 87 blocks - 1:10 SHTOI/gm
Voracek 153 gms - 107pts - 71PIMs -382SOG - 71 hits - 38 blocks - :13 SHTOI/gm

and yes, this is still ROR's 19, 20, 21 years and Voracek's 22, 23 and 24.

Game, set, match.

And I don't even think the numbers are necessary to prove why ROR > Voracek. Voracek is not as good as people make him out to be.

You don't even know what your doing with your own team. How can anyone take you seriously?

Oh look at that. PIT vs NYR next week. Let's see how your borderline playoff team does.

when do you and i play?

i wanna see how i compare against a borderline team from the east.