Bet Payment to PIT from WSH

[armandtanzarian]

Well since Kareem quit and then Shiv quit and now Shiv is back, maybe the deal is void? Now thats some shit stirring....I wouldnt have a problem with Thom presenting a case...lol

[kyuss]

Are you making bets with the franchise or bets with the GM? Stuff like this needs to be clarified. Odd situation with betting GM gone and gambling future assets before they are even permitted to be traded. Really sucks for Thom.

yeah.. i mean, the poor guy would have to pay Kareem debts like forever :

the Nashville Predators will give the Caps a 2nd rounder (of the following entry draft) after each season in which Nashville will fail to qualify for the playoffs.

Conversely, The Washington Capitals will give the Preds a 2nd rounder (of the following entry draft) after each season in which Nashville will make the playoffs.

http://bbkl.ca/viewtopic.php?f=52&t=6251

not sure how to address this thing, it sucks no matter if it pertains already tradable picks or not.

Bring back Kareem so that creditors will have their due!!

Maybe betting debts should be attached to the GM and their payment due as first step back for a returning GM.. on the other hand, this way a GM can make a big bet, stay if he wins and just leave if he doesn't.

[Robin Hood]

Just like Thom inherited Kareem's awesome assets when he took over as GM, he also inherits his bets and debts. You don't just take over Assets. You must also take over Liabilities. That's how it works in the real NHL when a team is sold to a new owner or a new GM takes over but a "conditional" pick is owed.

[Shep]

Just like Thom inherited Kareem's awesome assets when he took over as GM, he also inherits his bets and debts. You don't just take over Assets. You must also take over Liabilities. That's how it works in the real NHL when a team is sold to a new owner or a new GM takes over but a "conditional" pick is owed.

I don't necessarily agree with this at all, especially considering it's being bet with picks that are un-tradable and thus should be considered a gentleman's agreement. If a 3rd rounder in 2013 was owed and there was no pick currently owned, I don't think it's fair for the new GM to have to go out and find that 3rd rounder.

If it was up to me the bet would be void, but it's not my decision to make so.

[Chuck Norris]

Personally I'd say this should be null and void. You're betting with the GM, not the team. I'm sure Thom had no idea about this and would have objected to it if he had known when he took over. If I were Thom I'd be pissed if this is upheld as this is stripping two big assets for him; through no fault of his own.

[Lee]

Maybe come to a happy middle with Thom keeping his picks and extra picks awarded at the end of the mentioned rounds to Shiv?

[Tony]

what a bunch of bullshit ... VOID

when Kareem comes back (because it's bound to happen) he can give his picks then from whichever team he has ... Thom doesn't owe you shit

[Lee]

what a bunch of bullshit ... VOID

when Kareem comes back (because it's bound to happen) he can give his picks then from whichever team he has ... Thom doesn't owe you shit

We are a better place without Kareem.

[bills09]

Is there no precedence for this?

[Robin Hood]

Guys. I won this bet WHILE kareem was GM. The only reason they were not sent to me is because we didn't want to track 2014 picks yet. I won these picks before Thom took over...

[armandtanzarian]

Is there no precedence for this?

I dont think so. It was bound to happen with our turnover and the dealing and betting of future picks or assets that are not legally available to be traded. The gentleman thing comes into play. I am sure Thom could say fuck you I am not Kareem and I am not a gentelman, lol. This definetely could lead to some new policy and i think this may have a place for further discussion in the CC tbh...Not fair to either party and some rules need to be laid with regards to multiple issues in this case.

[Robin Hood]

Guys. I repeat. This bet was "won" a year ago. Kareem was still the GM. In fact, this thread is Kareem confirming sending me those picks, then Mike/Scott saying that I would get it when 2014 picks can be moved and tracked. If the bet was for 2013 picks, I would have them on my roster already as Kareem already confirmed a year ago...

[armandtanzarian]

But Kareem quit after and then you quit. You just happened to come back to the same team after an absence. What would happen if a new GM had taken over the Pens? There is a lot of subjectivity involved in this you have to admit? A lot of variables introduced after the "gentlemans bet" was conceived. Betting un-tradeable 2014 picks, both GM's quitting before completion, one returning while another new GM is involved, making an agreement with one GM for a future transaction(is this making an agreement with the franchise or making one with the GM?). stuff like this needs to be clarified for future reference. I am not saying your position is right or wrong shiv I am just saying from a league rule standpoint we have a bunch of smelly issues here that need to be addressed going forward.

[Robin Hood]

But Kareem quit after and then you quit. You just happened to come back to the same team after an absence. What would happen if a new GM had taken over the Pens? There is a lot of subjectivity involved in this you have to admit? A lot of variables introduced after the "gentlemans bet" was conceived. Betting un-tradeable 2014 picks, both GM's quitting before completion, one returning while another new GM is involved, making an agreement with one GM for a future transaction(is this making an agreement with the franchise or making one with the GM?). stuff like this needs to be clarified for future reference. I am not saying your position is right or wrong shiv I am just saying from a league rule standpoint we have a bunch of smelly issues here that need to be addressed going forward.

Regardless of who the GM of PIT or WSH are, the bet is between WSH and PIT because WSH and PIT assets are on the line. And I repeat the ONLY REASON I don't already have the picks is because we didn't want to add admin issues by having to track 2014 picks. I was told PIT would have the picks when 2014 picks began to be tracked.

[armandtanzarian]

After reading through the thread again Shiv, you have a valid point. I guess the issue comes down to the rejection of trading the 2014 picks and having the gentlemans agreement in place to move those picks when legal to move. Were those picks listed as assets when Thom took over Washington or were they already removed? I know we werent keeping track in the league but some teams did themselves...

[Robin Hood]

Yes, can everyone please read through this thread from the beginning. Look at what happened. Kareem sent me the picks. Then Mike/Scott said No, you'll have them when we can start tracking 2014 picks...Which essentially means WSH confirmed sending those picks only deffered due to admin issues.

[armandtanzarian]

I think i have to agree with Shiv here. This thread in the Washington team area had his picks listed as removed, as in no 1st and 2nd for 2014.

viewtopic.php?f=30&t=35#p119

Those picks are not there. Kareem was always detailed and organized. This has opened a new can of worms with regards to new rules and such, but Shiv should have those picks. That is just my opinion based on the information available.

[Mike]

Just to note, I did not mean to imply you could have these picks when 2014 picks became active. Maybe that's what Scott meant, but it's not cool with me. Regardless of the new GM in Washington these picks were not available to deal with. Why? For the very reason of GMs quitting. If we were to allow this, someone could trade away all their picks for years and years to come in "gentlemen's agreements" and quit the league. Not fair to new GMs.

[armandtanzarian]

Another valid point Mike. A future franchise protection from a league credibility standpoint.

[Shep]

Just to note, I did not mean to imply you could have these picks when 2014 picks became active. Maybe that's what Scott meant, but it's not cool with me.

I took it that way from your post, too. You did not seem to agree with it at all.