JT is outta here: TBL-BUF-WSH

[MSP4LYFE]

My organizational depth is weaker as a result of this deal, but now my team is stronger, if you thought I was good before...Watch out.

marginally better imo

You haven't examined the stats very closely then...I did much more than just adding JT, I also added Orpik who is a machine in BS, Hits and SHTOI, I was able to add Peter Schaefer who does everything but hit better than Grier, and was able to bring on P.A. Parenteau who is playing on the top line, in stead of the overrated Carcillo.

[Scott]

My organizational depth is weaker as a result of this deal, but now my team is stronger, if you thought I was good before...Watch out.

marginally better imo

You haven't examined the stats very closely then...I did much more than just adding JT, I also added Orpik who is a machine in BS, Hits and SHTOI, I was able to add Peter Schaefer who does everything but hit better than Grier, and was able to bring on P.A. Parenteau who is playing on the top line, in stead of the overrated Carcillo.

Oh I'm well aware of who you added and what they do.. I just really don't see the moves making HUGE improvments on your prior roster. But yes, you're better nonetheless..

[MSP4LYFE]

My organizational depth is weaker as a result of this deal, but now my team is stronger, if you thought I was good before...Watch out.

marginally better imo

You haven't examined the stats very closely then...I did much more than just adding JT, I also added Orpik who is a machine in BS, Hits and SHTOI, I was able to add Peter Schaefer who does everything but hit better than Grier, and was able to bring on P.A. Parenteau who is playing on the top line, in stead of the overrated Carcillo.

Oh I'm well aware of who you added and what they do.. I just really don't see the moves making HUGE improvments on your prior roster. But yes, you're better nonetheless..

Well I definately disagree, I improved on hits and bs which was an area I sucked at prior to the moves I made in the last two days, and I am expecting a really big season from JT, whether or not that happens is a different story.

The one move I didn't like to make was losing Grier for essentially nothing, but the cap was such that I had no choice.

[Scott]

The cap's a real bitch, isn't she? lol

[MSP4LYFE]

The cap's a real bitch, isn't she? lol

Tell me about it...This summer is going to be a full scale fire sale for me.

Anyone who says you can't compete in this league without FA does not understand the cap very well.

[kyuss]

The cap's a real bitch, isn't she? lol

Tell me about it...This summer is going to be a full scale fire sale for me.

Anyone who says you can't compete in this league without FA does not understand the cap very well.

or maybe you're (acting like if you were) missing something..
the cap will force you to move some players, not to trade them for less than their value.. there will be several teams with the cap space needed to take your highly paid players, not just one option.. so you won't be forced to accept any deal where you won't get something good back.. and guess what, the few who inherited a team with nothing good on it (not talking about me) will hardly be the receiving part cause they won't have much to offer you for your big players.

disclaimer: i am NOT advocating FA, again.

[Scott]

The cap's a real bitch, isn't she? lol

Tell me about it...This summer is going to be a full scale fire sale for me.

Anyone who says you can't compete in this league without FA does not understand the cap very well.

That's what I had to do this past off season. Then I just wasn't happy with my team so I created the illusion I was ripping my team apart again.. and ended up with this product! I just made sure some weaker teams got some good players..

[Nick]

I think Matt 100% proved this past season and off-season, that in a league with as much movement you can turn a team around very easily. He went from a team with very minor assets (2nd overall selection) to a team that is competitive.


I'm proving how easy it is to look good on paper but actually suck completely.

[MSP4LYFE]

or maybe you're (acting like if you were) missing something..
the cap will force you to move some players, not to trade them for less than their value.. there will be several teams with the cap space needed to take your highly paid players, not just one option.. so you won't be forced to accept any deal where you won't get something good back.. and guess what, the few who inherited a team with nothing good on it (not talking about me) will hardly be the receiving part cause they won't have much to offer you for your big players.

disclaimer: i am NOT advocating FA, again.

On the contrary my retarded Italian friend, it is the weak teams with top picks (and thusly elite young talent with cheap contracts), who will be the top bidders for such players. Furthermore, no contending team makes an "impact" move with the competition...Further limiting the target market to weaker teams.

[Scott]

It's true, if you're a "rebuilder" and you're pro-active at the right time.. you'll pick up good players relatively cheap. Mash is 100% proof of that.. his deal for Malkin with me last off season and the deal where he traded his 1st rounder for 2 or 3 studs. That's how it's done folks! I've told Lee(and many others) as much but it's up to him to listen..

[MSP4LYFE]

Exactly...

Personally, I think Tony completely fucked up by turning down my offer of Kadri + Bergeron for Toews, and I'm not just saying that because I wanted Toews (frankly I like JT/Sedin more), but when you have so few assets, any time you can turn one great asset into two very good, potentially great assets, you have to do it, and continue doing it until you have enough assets where you can afford to restart the cycle and give up two very good assets for one great asset. It's a proven system, one Scott, Nick, Matt, Neel, Shiv and I (among others) have implemented to achieve sucess.

[kyuss]

or maybe you're (acting like if you were) missing something..
the cap will force you to move some players, not to trade them for less than their value.. there will be several teams with the cap space needed to take your highly paid players, not just one option.. so you won't be forced to accept any deal where you won't get something good back.. and guess what, the few who inherited a team with nothing good on it (not talking about me) will hardly be the receiving part cause they won't have much to offer you for your big players.

disclaimer: i am NOT advocating FA, again.

On the contrary my retarded Italian friend, it is the weak teams with top picks (and thusly elite young talent with cheap contracts), who will be the top bidders for such players. Furthermore, no contending team makes an "impact" move with the competition...Further limiting the target market to weaker teams.

guess what, some GMs joined getting weaker teams while not even having their top picks lol...
but that's not even relevant, because..
1- no one can be a top bidder if he doesn't possess anything to bid, no matter how much cap room he has.
2- you said it yourself, top bidder will get the player you're forced to trade.. -> you won't trade such player for a package that is supposed to hold less value than the player you trade.. thus getting such player on paper wouldn't make the receiving team more competitive anyway (maybe short term, but not 'overall')

Wake me up when you are forced to trade Stamkos to Philly for Sexton, lol.

In the meantime you'll have plenty of time to try to learn that dropping insults out of your ass won't make your biased arguments any better.

[Scott]

Mik, the laws of expectations come into play too. Also, 1st round picks are like stacks of gold in this league.. remember that

[MSP4LYFE]

guess what, some GMs joined getting weaker teams while not even having their top picks lol...
but that's not even relevant, because..
1- no one can be a top bidder if he doesn't possess anything to bid, no matter how much cap room he has.
2- you said it yourself, top bidder will get the player you're forced to trade.. -> you won't trade such player for a package that is supposed to hold less value than the player you trade.. thus getting such player on paper wouldn't make the receiving team more competitive anyway (maybe short term, but not 'overall')

Wake me up when you are forced to trade Stamkos to Philly for Sexton, lol.

In the meantime you'll have plenty of time to try to learn that dropping insults out of your ass won't make your biased arguments any better.

For starters, I'm convinced you have absolutely no understanding of the word "bias", as you continually utilize this word in circumstances that are in your own best interests...

Secondly, there is no manager in this league that inherited a team with no 1st round pick(s) AND no significant assets to speak of, nor has any manager inherited a team with no first rounder for the two seasons following his inheriting a team. With that misconception out of the way, you have no argument here.

Even the worst team in this league (asset wise) like PHI can make a legitimate offer for Stamkos with Larsson/Couturier/Nougent Hopkins + Morin for instance. Not sure where "Dan Sexton" comes into play...

I look forward to your response which will more than likely dodge the questions posed, ignore the evidence presented, and stray further off topic in an unclear, incoherent and inarticulate manner.

[kyuss]

I think Matt 100% proved this past season and off-season, that in a league with as much movement you can turn a team around very easily. He went from a team with very minor assets (2nd overall selection) to a team that is competitive.


I'm proving how easy it is to look good on paper but actually suck completely.

first off, i guess we should wait for his team to be competitive in the real competition, not only in other GMs mind. I wish him that's the case.
Then, not sure but.. maybe he did have his 2nd overall pick at least?
more importantly, how many GMs have been replaced since he joined? i guess the worst GMs were sacked and other GMs learnt from their experience.. all this after the best/more ready GMs (and Mash could be one of them as far as i know, albeit not from the start) had already taken full advantage of it.

Bottom line, if you're Nighthock, or me, or Lee.. you join the league and have no teams/GMs available anymore to rip off in deals, like others did in the past. So the comparison is hard to make and Matt eventual success would hardly prove anything more than him having done a great job.

I'm not here saying a GM can not improve his team, any GM has a chance of doing that.. just that making a terrible team (meant assets wise, not necessarily going by previous season results) really competitive under our rules and circumstances would take several yrs even to the best of them.

[Scott]

Mik, it really is ALL timing.

You seriously don't think if you traded Gaborik you couldn't get 2-4 good assets? And then turn 1 or 2 of those assets into a better one?

If I'm rebuilding.. that's what I'm doing. 2 steps back, 3 forward, 1 back, 2 forward.. and so on. It really IS that simple!!

[kyuss]

Mik, the laws of expectations come into play too.

not sure what this is supposed to mean

Also, 1st round picks are like stacks of gold in this league.. remember that

yeah, i guess it would have been nice to have NSH 1st 2010..

[Scott]

I think Matt 100% proved this past season and off-season, that in a league with as much movement you can turn a team around very easily. He went from a team with very minor assets (2nd overall selection) to a team that is competitive.


I'm proving how easy it is to look good on paper but actually suck completely.

first off, i guess we should wait for his team to be competitive in the real competition, not only in other GMs mind. I wish him that's the case.
Then, not sure but.. maybe he did have his 2nd overall pick at least?
more importantly, how many GMs have been replaced since he joined? i guess the worst GMs were sacked and other GMs learnt from their experience.. all this after the best/more ready GMs (and Mash could be one of them as far as i know, albeit not from the start) had already taken full advantage of it.

Bottom line, if you're Nighthock, or me, or Lee.. you join the league and have no teams/GMs available anymore to rip off in deals, like others did in the past. So the comparison is hard to make and Matt eventual success would hardly prove anything more than him having done a great job.

I'm not here saying a GM can not improve his team, any GM has a chance of doing that.. just that making a terrible team (meant assets wise, not necessarily going by previous season results) really competitive under our rules and circumstances would take several yrs even to the best of them.

With this attitude, you're only setting yourself up for failure. If you just know you're good, you will be.. period. If you want to whine, bitch, and moan. it'll make you feel better when you're at the bottom of the heep.

Pro-activeness wins fantasy hockey!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[MSP4LYFE]

I think Matt 100% proved this past season and off-season, that in a league with as much movement you can turn a team around very easily. He went from a team with very minor assets (2nd overall selection) to a team that is competitive.


I'm proving how easy it is to look good on paper but actually suck completely.

first off, i guess we should wait for his team to be competitive in the real competition, not only in other GMs mind. I wish him that's the case.
Then, not sure but.. maybe he did have his 2nd overall pick at least?
more importantly, how many GMs have been replaced since he joined? i guess the worst GMs were sacked and other GMs learnt from their experience.. all this after the best/more ready GMs (and Mash could be one of them as far as i know, albeit not from the start) had already taken full advantage of it.

Bottom line, if you're Nighthock, or me, or Lee.. you join the league and have no teams/GMs available anymore to rip off in deals, like others did in the past. So the comparison is hard to make and Matt eventual success would hardly prove anything more than him having done a great job.

I'm not here saying a GM can not improve his team, any GM has a chance of doing that.. just that making a terrible team (meant assets wise, not necessarily going by previous season results) really competitive under our rules and circumstances would take several yrs even to the best of them.

Your an idiot if you think the good teams got good just by ripping off people...The good teams got good because they had the foresight to acquire certain players when their value perhaps wasn't what it was today, or simply dealing great peices for multiple good pieces, and building up their organization that way. If your logic had any semblance of truth to it, I personally would have a much harder time making deals or acquiring good players today, as opposed to yesterday, and that simply isn't the case.

[Lee]

What are you guys talking about. I made a blockbuster today..


Legein and Draper for Grier and a 7th.

Well on my way to a dynasty.