Buffalo/Nashville

[Sensfanjosh]

I'll admit I appreciated the buddy system and still regularly consult a few guys, (Steve, shep, chuck and shiv to name a few) but at the same time I wonder as has been mentioned if it hasn't been a case where "I got mine and fuck the rest". Again I don't care to go through past trades and not accusing anyone etc. I guess I'm just thinking that preventing further 'rapings' when most of the league is in shambles and a few top teams have most of the talent seems to be a weak stance. Not claiming to have an solution either just discussing. I feel my team was a lower tier and I've improved it a bit since taking over but it's required me to be very cheap in my deals and sticky about valuation ( which probably has led to some ill will haha) but it seemed like the only way a team with limited resources can improve.

[kyuss]

.. but it's required me to be very cheap in my deals and sticky about valuation ( which probably has led to some ill will haha) but it seemed like the only way a team with limited resources can improve.

i can hear you, when you start with limited resources you feel the duty of trying hard to make the most out of any opportunity you get.. i wouldn't worry too much when some ill will comes out of that.

[Shep]

I'm not saying what Mik did was wrong. Is somebody offered me that, I'd accept it. We're not CRYING for it.

I don't care about the trade, per se. I'm just getting frustrated at him defending it when IMO it's pretty obvious how one-sided it is. We've all raped new GM's. It happens. I've had a GM offer me something that I was raping so bad I literally felt guilty and countered the same offer he sent, with more on my end.

I haven't been around long enough to really comment on past dealings or bad trades but just thought i would add something to the discussion: to the gms who previously took advantage of new guys and are seeking to change things, outside of the trade buddy system what exactly has changed? I'm not being a dick I'm genuinely asking what has been made different, as it seems kind of silly to change things after you've set yourself up nicely for the indefinite future too.

as far as rules in place nothing. I know though when dealing with a new GM I always go to guys like shep or billy and ask their opinions on deals before making them to ensure it is fair. It's a concious effort not to rape the new guys. It's wayy different then back in the day when everyone wanted the home run deal. It is wayyyyy better than before, anyone here at the begining would have to agree with me.

This is the same with me. If a NEW GM offers me something, or we're in discussions, and I feel I'm getting a very good deal, I always ask Shook, Steve, whoever because I don't want to be "that guy" that rapes the noobie. Especially because my team is pretty established and I've been in the league since it's creation. Obviously if somebody says "I'll trade you Ott for a 1st" it's hard to say no (*note, this never happened just a random example).

The fact is, a lot of the rapings happened before ANYBODY knew player values. We were all new and some learned quicker than others. Of course there are times when a new GM comes in and gets pummeled by offers from the vets and rapings occurred. I'm sure Thom, Phion, Josh, Pete, etc can attest too. I'm sure they were PM'd and bombarded on MSN plenty of times when they first started.

/blahblahblah

[thom54]

yes, I was definitely bombarded by a select few GM's

[Phion Keneuf]

As was I lol

[Sensfanjosh]

I only got offers on kronwall, briere, Hamilton and tarasenko no one wanted anything else to start hahaha

[bma]

I dont know why everyone is getting so worked up here. I mean, it's kind of obvious that Mik won the deal. He wouldn't do a deal that was "fair" anyways. Not every deal made in this league is going to be "fair". Its all based on the fact that every GM has different valuations of players, prospects, and picks. Thats what makes trading interesting.

I think like Steve said, people are just worried that Buffalo is going to go down the shitter like Dallas and Calgary once did with their former GMs. I'll be honest, if Phion makes 2,3,4 more questionable trades, then maybe there's something to talk about/worry about. However, his previous deals have been fine. It's just a different direction that he's taking his team. I've had limited exposure with him, but he seems like he knows his hockey. If any vet GM did the same deal Phion just did, people would have no problem with it.

I guess in a way, this reaction is good. People are trying to protect the franchises..but at the same time, we need to realize that Phion deserves a chance to make his mark on his team. I think it's too easy for us to jump to conclusions and think he's going to ruin Buffalo once we see a questionable trade. But we need to keep in mind that not every trade will be fair. There will be winners and losers, just like any other professional league.

ps. Mik, like Mike and Shep have said. There's really no point for you to defend this trade..accept that you got a good deal and move on. The fact that you are defending this trade and making it seem like you gave up a lot to Brad Richards is quite annoying.

pps. I don't have anything against Chris and Kareem. I like them, they are well spoken (which I appreciate), and I find them quite entertaining to have around. But the constant negativity and desperate shout for attention is tiresome. If I had quit BBKL, I wouldn't come close to these forums at all. Unless you want to join BBKL again, why are you still here? The hockey talk here isn't that great TBH. I'm sure you could get better hockey conversations with your buddies in real life. Why the fuck would you come on to a forum with 30 rando's everyday to be a dick? It's mind boggling to me.

[shooker]

I only got offers on kronwall, briere, Hamilton and tarasenko no one wanted anything else to start hahaha

yet you still asked for Franks help when it came to drafting

[kimmer]

bcoola that is the second best post u have ever written.

[Sensfanjosh]

Haha honestly felt like I had an awesome draft though most of his picks from last year have appreciated in value. I plan on keeping them through maturation for the most part too so league value doesn't concern me.

[Shep]

BTW, I also want to say that I'm glad Phion is happy with the deal, and I don't want this to discourage him in any way shape or form. Obviously it's your team and you can do with it as you please. I think the general opinion, again everybody values everything differently, is that you should have been able to get a solid roster player instead of the 2nd. A periph guy at the least.

Anyways..

Just ask for opinions if you aren't sure, as everybody will be as brutally honest with you there as they are here You're a good guy and you'll be successful in this league I'm sure.

Cheers buddy, wish you the best in the league.

[kimmer]

yoyo sheps gheyyyyy

[kyuss]

ps. Mik, like Mike and Shep have said. There's really no point for you to defend this trade..accept that you got a good deal and move on. The fact that you are defending this trade and making it seem like you gave up a lot to Brad Richards is quite annoying.

Bry, i never said this doesn't look like a good deal for my team: considering that pick wouldn't be top 5 in my hands, even if i like Etem's bbkl potential this was quite an easy deal to make in my current position.

What i've been questioning is it being called a rape as of today (maybe in 2 yrs, maybe not at all. For him that pick could very well be top 5 and turn out great), or even calling it veto worthy in a league that has never vetoed trades.
And the fact Phion's cycle (turning Pacio into those assets) was awful; it looks fine to me.

Apologies to you and others if i was annoying in the process.

[Robin Hood]

Mik, shut up. No one likes you.

[kyuss]

Mik, shut up. No one likes you.

not sure how those two things would be related anyway.

[kimmer]

I work at Jane and Finch. Italians will never back down from an argument lol. TRUST

[Tony]

I like you, Mik

[Phion Keneuf]

Don't talk shit about my fellow italian. Ill hurt you

[Nick]

Ye that was shiv's failed attempt at humor


I think Mik is awesome for the league, and believe he is an awesome Gm - except for when I need to trade with him.

Phion I think the reason so many commented against your side of the deal, is that it's one we've seen many times before: new guy comes in, trades away vet nhlers for future assets, realizes he has not
NHL team, and finds no market for distant futures and realizes 3/4 of futures = nothing. Hence the ruined teams. Very, Very few teams have built thought youth/the draft - its takes patience, due diligence ( as in actually knowing the prospect and not the hype) and luck, also
The willingness to admit when you were wrong on a player.

With too much continued Scott, Kareem and Chris this league would suck, they add more drama then their GMing is worth. Yes - all solid hockey guys when not on the rag.

[The BBKL Insider]

I like you Mik


we're Mobsters