BBKL policy for Centers and Wingers

Anything goes here OT stuff is OK too!

Re: BBKL policy for Centers and Wingers

Postby Shep » Wed Jun 08, 2011 9:18 am

Sorry, just went through the sentres.

I went from 6 Centres and 8 Wingers to 11 Centres and 3 Wingers.

132 FOW in 82 games is now considered a CENTRE?!?!?!

153 FOW in 74 games is now considered a CENTRE?!?!?!

Those are BRUTAL FOW totals. This FOR is unreal too. For fuck sake.

I have THREE wingers..

Ryan, Semin, Avery.

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Re: BBKL policy for Centers and Wingers

Postby Lee » Wed Jun 08, 2011 9:23 am

FOW shouldn't determine whether or not a player is a center. FOT should.

With that said, disputes should be a case by case basis.
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Re: BBKL policy for Centers and Wingers

Postby kyuss » Wed Jun 08, 2011 9:35 am

it's not about FOW, and it's not only about FOT either, it is about FOT/icetime.

Or you think a forward should be a winger only because he plays 5 minutes per game?
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Re: BBKL policy for Centers and Wingers

Postby Shep » Wed Jun 08, 2011 9:36 am

Kezia wrote:FOW shouldn't determine whether or not a player is a center. FOT should.

With that said, disputes should be a case by case basis.

You're definitely right.

McCormick: 316 FOT
Dupuis: 331 in 74 games, 4th on the team so by defeault becomes a Centre .. McClement played 24 games for the Avs and had 321 FOT .

ARE YOU KIDDING ME?

McCormick averages 3.9 FOT/G in 11 minutes.. How is that a centre?!
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Re: BBKL policy for Centers and Wingers

Postby kyuss » Wed Jun 08, 2011 9:43 am

Shep wrote:132 FOW in 82 games is now considered a CENTRE?!?!?!

153 FOW in 74 games is now considered a CENTRE?!?!?!

for example, Josefson had 95 FW last season.. yet he is a center, i don't see anything wrong with that.


I have THREE wingers..

Ryan, Semin, Avery.

J.Williams, Kassian..

as for the 11 centers, i guess using 10 of them did help you last season, didn't it?
(as for Marleau, it sucks cause you didn't benefit from him as a winger last year, but still could in the 2nd part of next season)


McCormick: 316 FOT
Dupuis: 331 in 74 games, 4th on the team so by defeault becomes a Centre .. McClement played 24 games for the Avs and had 321 FOT .

so what? McClement and Dupuis are centers as well.
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Re: BBKL policy for Centers and Wingers

Postby Shep » Wed Jun 08, 2011 9:51 am

kyuss wrote:for example, Josefson had 95 FW last season.. yet he is a center, i don't see anything wrong with that.

Yes but he played 28 games.

I do have a problem with the FOT rule. You guys are arguing against me because FOW is the stat we use. So why are we using FACEOFFS TAKEN to determine who is a centre?

How does that make sense?

J.Williams, Kassian..

as for the 11 centers, i guess using 10 of them did help you last season, didn't it?
(as for Marleau, it sucks cause you didn't benefit from him as a winger last year, but still could in the 2nd part of next season)

Jason Williams doesn't count. He signed because of injuries. Reasons he was a UFA. Though he should get signed this summer me thinks by a team like Florida.

And no, I didn't benefit because half these "centres" had brutal FOW totals.

so what? McClement and Dupuis are centers as well.

Ugh..
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Re: BBKL policy for Centers and Wingers

Postby kyuss » Wed Jun 08, 2011 10:16 am

Shep wrote:
kyuss wrote:for example, Josefson had 95 FW last season.. yet he is a center, i don't see anything wrong with that.

Yes but he played 28 games.

I do have a problem with the FOT rule. You guys are arguing against me because FOW is the stat we use. So why are we using FACEOFFS TAKEN to determine who is a centre?

How does that make sense?

if he plays center for our purposes (i.e takes faceoff) and sucks at one aspect of that position, he still plays C for our purposes.
If a defender tries to block a lot of shots but never succeed, he is still going to be a D..

Jason Williams doesn't count. He signed because of injuries. Reasons he was a UFA. Though he should get signed this summer me thinks by a team like Florida.

so why shouldn't count.

And no, I didn't benefit because half these "centres" had brutal FOW totals.

having centers playing W and recording 200FW is not better as for FW than having winger that don't take any faceoff?

so what? McClement and Dupuis are centers as well.

Ugh..

they are centers who played centers.. how should we list them differently?
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Re: BBKL policy for Centers and Wingers

Postby Shep » Wed Jun 08, 2011 10:29 am

kyuss wrote:so why shouldn't count.

I only said that because I'm trying to trade him. He's garbage and definitely WONT be signed.

having centers playing W and recording 200FW is not better as for FW than having winger that don't take any faceoff?

they are centers who played centers.. how should we list them differently?

Whatever, it's obvious there are many flaws in the system. Everybody is too stubborn to even CONSIDER subjectivity.

I knew from the start nothing would be changed,, I just wanted raise enough awareness with the flaws.

The system is a joke with large flaws when you have Marleau listed as a centre and Malkin listed as a winger..

I'm done.
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Re: BBKL policy for Centers and Wingers

Postby kyuss » Wed Jun 08, 2011 10:42 am

Shep wrote:
kyuss wrote:so why shouldn't count.

I only said that because I'm trying to trade him. He's garbage and definitely WONT be signed.

having centers playing W and recording 200FW is not better as for FW than having winger that don't take any faceoff?

they are centers who played centers.. how should we list them differently?

Whatever, it's obvious there are many flaws in the system. Everybody is too stubborn to even CONSIDER subjectivity.

i don't see how stubborness is involved.. it's just that bringing in subjectivity would make all this worthless.

the only flaw i've seen so far is if Iginla was a center had Calgary traded one of their top 4C at the deadline.

Malkin W and Marleau C are not flaws..
as for Malkin it is the result of some retards playing him out of position; Marleau.. well, as far as i'm concerned he should have always stayed at C.. but anyway, as far as BBKL goes he did take 549 FO, so hardly a flaw..
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Re: BBKL policy for Centers and Wingers

Postby Shep » Wed Jun 08, 2011 10:54 am

kyuss wrote:
Shep wrote:
kyuss wrote:so why shouldn't count.

I only said that because I'm trying to trade him. He's garbage and definitely WONT be signed.

having centers playing W and recording 200FW is not better as for FW than having winger that don't take any faceoff?

they are centers who played centers.. how should we list them differently?

Whatever, it's obvious there are many flaws in the system. Everybody is too stubborn to even CONSIDER subjectivity.

i don't see how stubborness is involved.. it's just that bringing in subjectivity would make all this worthless.

the only flaw i've seen so far is if Iginla was a center had Calgary traded one of their top 4C at the deadline.

Malkin W and Marleau C are not flaws..
as for Malkin it is the result of some retards playing him out of position; Marleau.. well, as far as i'm concerned he should have always stayed at C.. but anyway, as far as BBKL goes he did take 549 FO, so hardly a flaw..

I understand the FOW/FOT argument, that's fine.

BUT HE IS NOT A CENTRE!

86% of his playing time is with FOT #1, #2, #3 on the team.

His faceoffs come from Penalty Killing and Thornton getting kicked out of draws for being so aggressive.


I don't even care that I have to trade away half my team. That doesn't even bother me. It bothers me that there are legit NHL wingers being marked as centres because of one stat we use, and legit NHL centres being marked as wingers.

He's a winger.
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Re: BBKL policy for Centers and Wingers

Postby kyuss » Wed Jun 08, 2011 11:18 am

Shep wrote:
kyuss wrote:
Shep wrote:
kyuss wrote:having centers playing W and recording 200FW is not better as for FW than having winger that don't take any faceoff?

they are centers who played centers.. how should we list them differently?

Whatever, it's obvious there are many flaws in the system. Everybody is too stubborn to even CONSIDER subjectivity.

i don't see how stubborness is involved.. it's just that bringing in subjectivity would make all this worthless.

the only flaw i've seen so far is if Iginla was a center had Calgary traded one of their top 4C at the deadline.

Malkin W and Marleau C are not flaws..
as for Malkin it is the result of some retards playing him out of position; Marleau.. well, as far as i'm concerned he should have always stayed at C.. but anyway, as far as BBKL goes he did take 549 FO, so hardly a flaw..

I understand the FOW/FOT argument, that's fine.

BUT HE IS NOT A CENTRE!

86% of his playing time is with FOT #1, #2, #3 on the team.

His faceoffs come from Penalty Killing and Thornton getting kicked out of draws for being so aggressive.

that doesn't matter for the BBKL game, as stated that's what we are caring about with this ruling.


I don't even care that I have to trade away half my team. That doesn't even bother me. It bothers me that there are legit NHL wingers being marked as centres because of one stat we use, and legit NHL centres being marked as wingers.

yet you were not bothered by the fact till now we had many more legit centers marked as wingers?
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Re: BBKL policy for Centers and Wingers

Postby Lee » Wed Jun 08, 2011 11:19 am

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Re: BBKL policy for Centers and Wingers

Postby Shep » Wed Jun 08, 2011 11:31 am

kyuss wrote:yet you were not bothered by the fact till now we had many more legit centers marked as wingers?

Not at all. I didn't care if somebody had Backes as a wing getting 500+ FOW.

It's part of the value.
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Re: BBKL policy for Centers and Wingers

Postby Scott » Wed Jun 08, 2011 11:37 am

Shep wrote:
kyuss wrote:yet you were not bothered by the fact till now we had many more legit centers marked as wingers?

Not at all. I didn't care if somebody had Backes as a wing getting 500+ FOW.

It's part of the value.

Shep, your last statement was my main argument the last few seasons.. and others argued the same but people just weren't having it. This new system does nothing but minimize fantasy value of players instead of enhance but what are you gonna do?
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Re: BBKL policy for Centers and Wingers

Postby Shep » Wed Jun 08, 2011 11:40 am

The Devil wrote:
Shep wrote:
kyuss wrote:yet you were not bothered by the fact till now we had many more legit centers marked as wingers?

Not at all. I didn't care if somebody had Backes as a wing getting 500+ FOW.

It's part of the value.

Shep, your last statement was my main argument the last few seasons.. and others argued the same but people just weren't having it. This new system does nothing but minimize fantasy value of players instead of enhance but what are you gonna do?

Seriously though, instead of having valuable wingers, you go to having a lot of less valuable centres.
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Re: BBKL policy for Centers and Wingers

Postby Shep » Wed Jun 08, 2011 11:41 am

I also just counted all of the centres.

There are 163 centres, which turns out to 5.45 centres per team on average.

We should SERIOUSLY consider making the centres a 4-6 slot now, because of the vast number of centres.
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Re: BBKL policy for Centers and Wingers

Postby kyuss » Wed Jun 08, 2011 11:43 am

The Devil wrote:
Shep wrote:
kyuss wrote:yet you were not bothered by the fact till now we had many more legit centers marked as wingers?

Not at all. I didn't care if somebody had Backes as a wing getting 500+ FOW.

It's part of the value.

Shep, your last statement was my main argument the last few seasons.. and others argued the same but people just weren't having it. This new system does nothing but minimize fantasy value of players instead of enhance but what are you gonna do?

well, reality is there are fewer 'wrong' positions under this system, i guessed that should matter.
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Re: BBKL policy for Centers and Wingers

Postby kyuss » Wed Jun 08, 2011 11:48 am

Shep wrote:Seriously though, instead of having valuable wingers, you go to having a lot of less valuable centres.

if the guy takes few faceoffs he will become a winger.. not sure why you keep talking like Marleau and others would stay C forever. It's only gonna happen if they do bring a significant contribution in the FO department.


also just counted all of the centres.

There are 163 centres, which turns out to 5.45 centres per team on average.

not saying they are many.. but how did you count it?
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Re: BBKL policy for Centers and Wingers

Postby Shep » Wed Jun 08, 2011 11:50 am

kyuss wrote:
Shep wrote:Seriously though, instead of having valuable wingers, you go to having a lot of less valuable centres.

if the guy takes few faceoffs he will become a winger.. not sure why you keep talking like Marleau and others would stay C forever. It's only gonna happen if they do bring a significant contribution in the FO department.

When can we propose a change? How long into the season?
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Re: BBKL policy for Centers and Wingers

Postby kyuss » Wed Jun 08, 2011 11:53 am

Shep wrote:
kyuss wrote:
Shep wrote:Seriously though, instead of having valuable wingers, you go to having a lot of less valuable centres.

if the guy takes few faceoffs he will become a winger.. not sure why you keep talking like Marleau and others would stay C forever. It's only gonna happen if they do bring a significant contribution in the FO department.

When can we propose a change? How long into the season?

as for what has been approved till now, that would be at the AllStarGame break.
And it wouldn't require a 'proposal'.
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